Nautical Words

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Hey c-b, now that I'm home I looked up "founder" (the verb) in the American Heritage Dictionary & got these definitions:
1. To sink below the surface of the water: The ship struck a reef and foundered.
2. To cave in; sink: The platform swayed and then foundered.
3. To fail utterly; collapse: a marriage that soon foundered.

Essentially founder means "to fail utterly, collapse." Flounder means "to move clumsily, thrash about," and hence "to proceed in confusion."

Oops. I meant "foot"--copying trivet's comment below. Geez, I need a nap....

Nasty food condition? You mean eating a bad Flounder? That would make your stomach founder.

Or that nasty food condition.

But if something founders, it doesn't quite sink, does it? Or sinks so slowly that there has to be another word to describe the action?

I always thought "founder" applies to something capsizing, striking aground in shallows, etc.

I've always liked founder in the sense of sinking . It means you're just plain going down. No reason to flounder about, just enjoy the ride.

Yes, but founder is such a triksy word...

You've got the builders and entrepreneurs, the failures and sinkages, plus the nasty foot condition...

keelhaul!

Trivet, please say you knew I was joking. :-)

Or flounder is to flail about and founder is to sink?

Oh, that one's easy. Flounder is a fish and founder is one of the guys who started the United States.

Er...no?

No problem. I first read the distinction on a list of "words commonly confused" I stumbled over which also included other interesting pairings like flounder & founder.

Whoops, I guess I missed the American Heritage Dictionary's definition then! Thanks palooka.

I guess that stuff about flotsam/jetsam could've gone on those pages, too...

Here's the American Heritage Dictionary's usage note on flotsam:
"Usage Note: In maritime law, flotsam applies to wreckage or cargo left floating on the sea after a shipwreck. Jetsam applies to cargo or equipment thrown overboard from a ship in distress and either sunk or washed ashore. The common phrase flotsam and jetsam is now used loosely to describe any objects found floating or washed ashore."

Thanks for the great words sionnach & the compliment reesetee

This is a wonderful list; I agree. I can almost smell the salt water.... :-)

caravel, gondola, canoe, kayak, currach, coracle, hooker?

That's what I have always understood to be the case, c_b. So, at what point does jetsam become flotsam? Maybe it's jetsam if you toss it overboard, but flotsam if someone else finds it.

A fine line...

Skipvia, I looked up these words, flotsam and jetsam, after you posted your comment, thinking that there was an "official" difference between the two. I wasn't satisfied with the dictionaries' definitions, which seemed to make them sound like the same thing. But some Wikipedia writer has kindly distinguished them clearly--jetsam was jettisoned, while flotsam is simply floating debris, as from a shipwreck. This person also pointed out that "jetsam" used to be spelled "jetsom," but the A replaced the O in the early 20th century.

Oh heck, why should I type it all here? Here's the link.

Thanks c_b & skipvia! I'll come down from the flying bridge long enough to add flotsam & jetsam.

How about those twin elves of the sea, flotsam and jetsam?

Wonderful list! It reminded me of a friend's dog, a schipperkey, which may belong on your list.

It took me long enough to find this list, but it's terrific. Thanks palooka!